Measure twice, spend once: Secrets for smarter job costing in construction

Charley Burtwistle (00:05):

What is up, everybody? Welcome back to another episode of “The Building Code.” I’m Charley Burtwistle.

Courtney Mattern (00:10):

And I’m Courtney Mattern.

Charley Burtwistle (00:11):

Courtney, how the heck are you?

Courtney Mattern (00:12):

I’m doing great. I’m super jazzed about 2025.

Charley Burtwistle (00:17):

Absolutely.

Courtney Mattern (00:18):

The end of 2024 was a grind, but I think the recharge, reset has really energized me. And we have the International Builders’ Show to look forward to.

Charley Burtwistle (00:27):

Right around the corner.

Courtney Mattern (00:28):

Yeah. And if anybody who’s listening knows, we rarely let Charley out of the building for obvious reasons, but he’s …

Charley Burtwistle (00:28):

Too important.

Courtney Mattern (00:34):

Yeah, he’s too important. He’s getting to come to Las Vegas though, so you’ll get to see both of us. Come say hi in the booth. We’ll put some links in the show notes so you can get a free pass. We’re going to have happy hours daily in the booth.

(00:47):

We’re going to have tons of customers coming to give customer-led demos, which is really interesting. This year we’re going to show you a little bit of our product roadmap. So, if you don’t have Vegas on your calendar, book that flight, book that trip, it’s worth it.

Charley Burtwistle (01:02):

Absolutely. It is going to be one-of-a-kind experience, as IBS always is, and I’m fired up. And you know who else is going to be at the International Builders’ Show?

Courtney Mattern (01:12):

Scott Beebe.

Charley Burtwistle (01:13):

Scott Beebe, who is the founder and head coach at My Business on Purpose. They work with business owners and key leaders building systems, processes and purpose using the Business on Purpose roadmap. To liberate business owners from the chaos of working in their business and help them get their lives back.

(01:31):

So, a lot of what he’s going to talk about is honestly, super closely aligned with Buildertrend’s vision and Buildertrend’s purpose. So, I’m fired up, but I will not steal anymore of the thunder. Let’s get Scott in here. Hey, Scott. Welcome to “The Building Code.” Super appreciate you making the time to join us today. We are excited. How are you doing?

Scott Beebe (01:50):

I’m great, I’m great. Charley, both you and Courtney, I’m really, really grateful that you’d allow me.

(01:54):

We tell people all the time, it’s a lot of work to do a podcast. So, the fact that you would let us to be a part of your stage and all, I’m just really grateful, so thanks.

Charley Burtwistle (02:02):

Oh, well, appreciate that. We always like to kick these off with just a quick intro. Who you are, where you came from, and how you got to where you’re at today?

Scott Beebe (02:10):

Yeah, so I’m Scott. Ashley and I’ve been married almost 27 years. We’ve got three kids. Well, I guess, technically four because one of them is married, so we inherited a child, I guess. So, one’s a grown man, but 23, 21, 20 at the time of this recording, a girl, boy and boy. So, our daughter’s married, as I said. She and her husband just spent four months living in Europe.

(02:31):

They saved up and went over there, lived, went to 17 different countries. Came back broke as they could be, but just filled with experience and joy, and so, they’re both back working. My daughter’s a teacher, my son-in-law works in student ministry at a church. And then we’ve got two boys both at university, and one’s a senior and one’s a sophomore.

(02:53):

So, we actually have a mission as a family is to be a light and to create space through wisdom, adventure and time around the table. So, that’s a little bit about me personally. And then about the business, we’ve got a team of 12 full-time, W-2 professionals in our business coaching and advisory firm, Business on Purpose. And we do one thing, and that’s all we do, we do it really well.

There’s a lot of things we don’t do well, but we do this one thing well, and that is we liberate owners from chaos to make time for what matters most.

Courtney Mattern (03:20):

Yeah. Scott, tell us a little bit about how you got started with Business on Purpose.

(03:24):

I did a rabbit hole deep dive today about your story and I love how you got started. So, tell our listeners how you came to be a business coach.

Scott Beebe (03:32):

Yeah, I can’t believe you asked. I didn’t know that this was fit for podcast fodder, but I’ll go ahead and share it since you asked. But my background is the start of a good joke. I was literally a telemarketer, a pastor and a drug salesman all at one time. So, they all three walked into a bar and I could go on and on, but anyway, I did a lot of that back and forth.

(03:52):

Actually, was a part of a nongovernmental organization for a while as well. And in February of 2015, my role was directly to the board of this really, it was a really small organization. But eight of the nine board members one day in February of 2015 resigned on the spot. There was a lot of back-end turmoil, things like that that I won’t go into.

(04:13):

But the reality is, is my role was, they brought me in. The eight brought me in and like, “Hey, what do we do? We’ve never seen this before.” And I’m like, “Me neither.” So, we sat there, and I tried to advise, and part of my advisement was you got to get rid of this role. And anyway, my role ended there, tenure ended, and I had a little bit of a runway.

(04:36):

And I had two buddies both in business for themselves, and one was a contractor and still is, and he builds new construction homebuilding in South Carolina. And I’d known him for years and we sat down and I’m like, “Hey, I’m going to start business coaching.” Because I’d been working with some people just personally not for pay, just personally.

(04:55):

And one of the phrases they told me, again, I’m not good at much, but apparently, I’m decent at this, is they say, “Scott, you help me see things I can’t see.” And I thought, “Huh, that’s fair. So, I wonder if I can actually turn that into something?” And these guys were super kind, they allowed me to coach them. I started with a one day, I think, it was a 10-hour vision, mission, values workshop.

(05:17):

I’ll never do that to a business owner again, it’s way too long to lock them in a room. But I gave them some feedback and my buddy said, “Hey, what do we do now? This is the most clarity I’ve ever had in my business. What do we do now?” And I said, “Well, I think we start meeting every week.” And he’s like, “All right, how much?”

(05:32):

And I literally made up a number. And he knows this whole story, so even if he hears this, they use Buildertrend, by the way. But even if he hears this, he’d be like he knows that story, and they’re still with us. He’s still, he’s my longest-serving client, still with us today. We’ll turn 10 …

Courtney Mattern (05:45):

Do you still meet every week?

Scott Beebe (05:47):

What’s that?

Courtney Mattern (05:47):

Do you still meet every week?

Scott Beebe (05:49):

So, we used to, I don’t do that to my clients either. Turns out that was way too often, so we actually meet with our clients mandatory twice monthly.

(05:58):

We’ve got some other optional things that we do, but yeah, twice monthly at least.

Courtney Mattern (06:01):

Well, one thing that stood out to me about My Business on Purpose when I first met some members of your team, was this alignment in our values of calming the chaos that comes with running a business.

(06:11):

And like what you just said, you mentioned that you were helping a business owner see what they couldn’t see. So, when we talk about chaos in business, what is the chaos? What is the chaos that you see?

Scott Beebe (06:27):

Courtney, I think we’ve got to look at chaos in a macro perspective and then we can drill down a little bit. There’s something that we’ve been on a bit of a campaign to spread into this idea, is that we have a common enemy. The three of us just in this conversation, we have a common enemy. And this enemy is said to prowl around like a roaring lion looking to devour anything in its path.

(06:48):

And we’ve named the enemy chaos, that’s what we call it. It is a common enemy that we all face, and it’s not just an enemy that can be solved. It’s what we call a perennial enemy, it comes back. You might punch it in the mouth, it goes off into the woods, but then it just comes back out on another side, in another seductive pattern to be able to come out there.

(07:08):

So, when you come out in the contractors’ world and ask the question, “What does chaos look like?” I think maybe even to better articulate, I can say what it sounds like. So, these are the phrases that we actually hear from the people that we have the privilege of being able to work with, these heroes that we get to work with, and that is this.

(07:26):

They’ll say things like this, “Nobody wants to work anymore. Oh my gosh, Charley, nobody wants to work anymore.” And of course, we ask them, “Is it that nobody wants to work anymore, or they just don’t want to work for you because you’re chaotic?” So, anyway, we’ll leave that there and come back. There’s other things that they say.

“Scott, we’re constantly putting out fires in our business. We have more money going out than is coming in. The front door’s open, but the garage door is wide open in the back. I’m juggling all these balls, and I just can’t keep these things up.” So, that’s the common verbiage. Had one person say this, “I wake up every day and feel like I throw Hail Mary’s all day long.”

(08:03):

I was like, “Wow.” We asked one guy, “What is chaos like?” And his only response was, “Monday through Friday.” So, that’s a little sampling maybe of what chaos sounds like in some of the advertisement from the people that we actually work with.

Charley Burtwistle (08:19):

Yeah. That’s definitely relatable, some things that Courtney and I hear all the time. And again, that’s why we’re so excited to have you on today is My Business on Purpose, you guys’ mission is so closely aligned to what we’re trying to do with Buildertrend as well, too.

And a lot of the same solutions, whether it’s business coaching or a software system exist when it comes to calming the chaos, as how do we systematize this? How do we get our arms around this and process everything out?

(08:48):

And have a better understanding of how our business is operating before we can understand what we need to do to change it. So, yeah, just super excited to have you on. And you mentioned cash flow is one of the main things or one of the agents of chaos that can come in and growl.

Courtney Mattern (09:03):

Shake everything up.

Charley Burtwistle (09:04):

Shake everything up. And that was one of the reasons we wanted to have you on today, was talk a little bit about job costing and why it’s so critical for construction companies to implement it efficiently.

(09:14):

Because that’s where everything starts or stops, if it comes to if you’re going to make money or not, is making sure that you have a good understanding on how to do that.

(09:22):

So, is that something that My Business on Purpose helps their members with and that your coaches can coach them up on? And why is that so important for a construction business to get right?

Scott Beebe (09:32):

Yeah, it’s one of the elements. So, when you take job costing, for instance, scheduling, whatever it might be, and you take those disciplines of a good contractor and put them … And a lot of times, we want to get in the airplane and go above the landscape to see what’s up there, and then come back down to the ground and work on it.

(09:47):

So, job cost is back, let’s call it, 10 feet off the ground. It’s not on the ground. You’re looking a little bit, but you’re not 60,000 feet above the air. If we were to go 60,000 feet above the air, let’s talk about how the business is built and where job costing fits in on that.

(10:01):

So, there’s three primary layers of every business, whether you’re selling remodeling services, new construction services, ice cream, hotel services. Whatever it is that you’re selling, software, there’s three layers of every business. The first layer is what we call the foundational cornerstones of every business.

(10:17):

And in our vernacular, we call it a Business Installation Roadmap. Well, within that, there are four categories, and so, we believe that those four cornerstones are purpose, people, process and profit. You pull any one of those out and the house begins to fall.

(10:32):

Now, within purpose, you’ve got things like articulated vision, mission, values, all these things have to be written, by the way. Michael Gerber said, “If it’s not written down, you don’t own it.”

Courtney Mattern (10:32):

It doesn’t exist.

Scott Beebe (10:41):

We’re a little bit harsher. We say if it’s not written down, it doesn’t exist, but anyway, I’ll leave it. So, you’ve got this purpose. Then you’ve got people, org charts, job roles, scorecards, all that. Then you’ve got process. Well, those are four major systems of the business, marketing, sales, ops and admin, and again, in that order.

(10:57):

And we can talk about that later as well. And then the cornerstone of profit, this is where you get into the cash flow, which eventually goes back into operations and profit, and that is job costing, scheduling, those sorts of things. So, understanding that foundation helps you to understand that there’s a slab sitting on top of those cornerstones, and that’s what we call the process slab.

(11:19):

So, all the processes that it takes to run the business is in there. And a business could have hundreds or thousands of processes, but if we categorize them, marketing, sales, op and admin. Right now, you all are in the marketing process of Buildertrend’s overall system because we’re having this conversation on podcast.

(11:38):

So, in those verticals, what those hold up are the four major walls, marketing, sales, ops, admin on that. So, when we talk about job costing, we’re really talking about job costing or a process that is on the concrete slab that sits on those foundations.

(11:52):

So, what we’ll usually tell people is, “Hey, you don’t have a scheduling problem. You don’t have a job costing problem. You don’t have a profit problem, you don’t have a sales problem, or a marketing problem. You have a process problem.” So, they think we have a product problem, “Our product’s not working and all that.”

(12:06):

It’s like, “No, no, no, no. What’s happened is you’ve not made a radical commitment to taking everything you see, systematizing it, processing it.” In other words, getting it out of your head into a captured place where other people can go grab that process, and be able to work it with or without you, and preferably without you.

Courtney Mattern (12:06):

Yeah.

Scott Beebe (12:24):

Because, ultimately, contractors want to run and grow a company with or without them. And it’s a misnomer when people come and say, “Well, you can’t sell a homebuilding company.” Really? What would you tell the thousands of people who have? You can absolutely sell a homebuilding company. What you cannot sell is a homebuilding company that is solely run out of your head. We can’t do that.

So, that once we identify that we don’t just have a job costing problem, but we have a process problem. Then we can narrow down and start getting in job costing because quite frankly, you can look on YouTube and find how to job cost. It’s not that hard. The harder part is to look on YouTube and get somebody to motivate you to actually do the job costing.

(13:04):

So that’s where from a coaching, advisory standpoint, you’ve got to have people outside of you going, “Hey, did you do it? Did you do it?” You guys probably played sports or did something that required coaching growing up, and what was your most favorite phrase from your coach? “Do it again.” Not at all, we hated that phrase.

(13:20):

But the reality is that phrase is what kept repetition, predictability and meaning. We call those the RPMs of great leadership. And that phrase, do it again, allowed us the repetition, predictability and meaning. So, whatever tool you use for job costing, labor, materials, it’s basic definition.

(13:36):

It’s more about you just doing it over and over and over again, than actually trying to find the perfect tool to do it. So, it’s really about the discipline of repetition in the idea of job costing that will help maintain that cash flow because you’ve got to know if you’re making money or not.

Charley Burtwistle (13:51):

Yeah. I love the way you teed that up, because one is the repetition, doing it again and again and again. But two is like that falls flat on its face, unless you have the other three cornerstones in place. You could have the perfect job cost set up and understand it and be ready to go.

(14:05):

But then if you can’t implement it or if your schedule breaks down, or if you don’t have the people to implement it, or you don’t have the admin to actually track it. All those things work in tandem with each other, so I love the way that you phrase that up.

(14:16):

And where the volubility of your coaches comes in, is they have that holistic view to understand it from start to finish.

Scott Beebe (14:24):

Yeah. You’ve got to be super careful, Charley. And next week, I’ll be speaking at Tampa at the Build Expo. So, we go to these all over the country and go speak and we’ll get questions. People come, and they’ll ask us or tell us, “Hey, are you going to speak on blank?”

(14:37):

And we say, “Well, we can. We can certainly handle that during either the talk time or the Q&A time, but really, I don’t know that that’s your problem. I think that’s a symptom of your problem or maybe a sign of your problem, but I’m not sure that that’s your problem.” So, take, for instance, we’ll get this one a ton, “I need more sales.”

(14:55):

Oh, okay. What do you mean? “Well, I just need more sales.” And there’s even a phraseology that says sales solves everything. Well, does sales solve everything or is our sales gasoline that you throw on an already burning fire? So, if you have a controlled burn, which we do a lot of in South Carolina, by the way, which control burn the base.

(15:18):

And you pour gasoline on a controlled burn, you get more controlled burn. But if you have an outrageous, roaring fire, think of the fires in Los Angeles, then you’ve got this outrageous burn. Well, you’re going to throw more gasoline on that? Please don’t. So, there are a lot of contractors that think sales solves everything, marketing solves everything, job costing solves everything.

(15:38):

But to your point, Charley, this holistic view in being able to go, “Hey, we can solve your job costing issue. It’s a process problem. We can solve your scheduling issue. It’s a process problem.” So, let’s go back to that and create these things along with the habitual repetition, predictability and meaning.

(15:55):

So, it’s not just you’re doing it, but there’s meaning involved with it, and you understand why you’re doing it. And for us, that’s to liberate owners from chaos.

Courtney Mattern (16:02):

Well, and sales, more sales probably aren’t going to solve the problem if you don’t have the right people. It’s actually going to make it worse. What good is it to take on more work when you can’t get it done well or get it done profitably?

(16:19):

And I think too, that’s one of our big points heading into this new year with our customers who have used Buildertrend for a long time, for things like scheduling or to-dos. And it’s like, “That’s great. You’re building a dream house, you’re keeping everybody in the loop, but another part of business is making sure that you make money.”

(16:38):

So, is there any actionable tips you’d offer up to construction businesses where their baseline problem, maybe areas that they should be looking for chaos? Where is that chaos coming from, if they feel like their biggest problem is they’re just not making money?

Scott Beebe (16:52):

Yes, okay. So, this is always an interesting one to me, especially in the construction space because construction is a beautiful animal, and it’s an ugly animal all at the same time. You can make a lot of money really fast, and you can lose a lot of money really fast all in this construction space, and so money is definitely an issue.

(17:11):

Obviously, cash flow has to be an issue depending on what kind of construction you’re in. But in the type of construction you all mainly deal with in the Buildertrend space, is what you’re dealing with is an issue where you’ve got a large sum of money. Sometimes upwards of 80%, 90% of every dollar that comes in goes right back out.

(17:28):

So, we tell contractors all the time, “You realize you’re not actually a builder. Please don’t be offended, but you’re a manager and more than that, you’re an accounting firm moving money back and forth.” So, a lot of times when you get $100,000 receivable in, $80,000 of that in a typical, new construction homebuilding company, $80,000 of that might go right back out to labor, supply, vendors, that sort thing.

(17:50):

So, you’re left with the 20 grand. So, we’ve got a principle in this financial literacy that we teach, and it says this. $1 is not $1. So, if we can just hang that for right now. So, what does that mean? Go one level lower, $1 in is always less than $1. $1 out is always more than $1. So, take, Courtney and Charley, for you guys, your paychecks when you get them.

(18:12):

And you get a paycheck for X, do you get to keep X? No, it’s X minus whatever. So, $1 in is always less than $1, but $1 out is always more. So, wherever you guys went to eat lunch today, the sandwich was $9.99. Did you pay $9.99? No, you paid $11.15. Especially after they said, “Hey, I’m just going to turn around the screen, Courtney, and you can answer a few questions.”

Courtney Mattern (18:35):

Yeah, I paid a $4 delivery fee today for my sandwich.

Scott Beebe (18:39):

Yeah. So, it’s just all you’re doing though is answering a few questions, even though it’s just you’re just giving money away, but whatever, we can talk about that later, too. Okay, so this $1 is not $1. $1 in is less than $1, $1 out is more than $1. And there’s a thing called Parkinson’s law. Michael Michalowicz talks about this a lot with his “Profit First” methodology.

(18:58):

But in it he says, “Work expands to the time allotted.” Well, with bank accounts, it’s sort of inverse. It’s money retains based on the number of bank accounts. So, if you take $100,000, $500,000, $1 million, put it all in one bank account, it’s going to leak. If you lose 15 grand, you’re not going to know because it’s 15 grand.

(19:19):

Now, in my world, I’m like, “15 grand.” But if it’s in a bucket of $1 million, you’re not going to see it. But if I can take that same $1 million and divide it 10 ways on 10 different bank accounts for 10 different purposes, all of a sudden, a $15,000 drop in one account, I’m going to notice right away.

(19:34):

So, there’s a principle that if you can just take every dollar that comes into the business and cut it up, subdivide it. It’s like Dave Ramsey for business is all it is, and you’re putting it in its different envelopes. You can go open bank accounts at the bank. Well, my banks charge me a fee. Then fire them, go hire another bank.

(19:51):

There are plenty of banks that would love to have your millions of dollars of deposits every year. That’s how they make money. So, you can start to subdivide the bank account and begin to name where each dollar goes over here in the operating expense account, the capital expense account, in all of those.

(20:05):

And the next thing you know, now they can afford software because they’ve got an operating account that’s flooded with cash to be able to afford those things. They’re not worried about all of this other stuff. So, the software can help them, the team members can help them, the 1099 subcontractors can help. All these people can help because they’ve got resources to be able to do that with.

Courtney Mattern (20:24):

I’m taking furious notes. Hopefully, I can also improve my own finances after this episode.

Charley Burtwistle (20:30):

Yeah. The lull of silence there, Courtney and I are both just fervently scribbling notes down, so apologies there.

Scott Beebe (20:37):

(20:53):

The thing is, Charley, as our kids were growing up, we did a thing at our house where two of our kids are boys, as I mentioned. So, we’d have those two boys bring a bunch of boys over to our house on Tuesday nights. And we’d sit around the fire and Ashley would cook like chili and just bulk food is what we called it.

She cooked a lot of bulk food, and we’d have 5 or 10, or 12 or 13 guys at our house, and we would talk about real stuff, but one of the things we talked about was money a lot and we worked on this principle. A guy named Andy Stanley said it, “Give, save, live, give, save, live.”

(21:06):

So, even those three categories, that’s what you’re doing is you’re subdividing your cash into those categories to be able to go. So, if you can begin to subdivide cash, and I know there’s a lot of people in the contracting space that go, “Gosh, there’s too much money to be able to deal with that.” No, there’s not.

(21:21):

We’ve got businesses up to about $65 million that are working in this process, so you are not too big to be able to do this. Once you get to about $100 million, that brings in some deeper level, CFO-level stuff, and things that you got to think about, and I get it.

(21:35):

But up until that, you really have no excuse, and you need to start subdividing your money. You can do it at work and at home.

Charley Burtwistle (21:41):

Yeah, I love that. One of the things that I keep coming back to is Courtney and I are scribbling down notes right now because we’re sponges. We love to learn. That’s why we tricked them into letting us host the podcast. It’s just a front row seat of classes that I could go to college, or I could sit here and host the podcast and learn just as much.

(22:01):

And luckily, a lot of the people that we work with have that growth mindset as well too, but everything that you’re preaching only works really if people are committed to changing. So, talk to us a little bit about how you get people on board. What we hear all the time is like, “I’ve been running my business for 15 years now and it’s worked fine.”

(22:20):

I’m sure that’s pushback that you guys hear a lot too is like, “How do you convince them that there is something better, even if it has been working fine, and commit to doing these things and making changes?” Because change is hard, but there’s always a better way, and that’s the phrase that we live by here at Buildertrend as well, too.

Scott Beebe (22:38):

Yeah, that’s a really good question, Charley. So, I think it was John Maxwell wrote a book something like “Good Leaders Ask Great Questions.” And one of the questions you just asked me is how do we convince an owner? And we tried to do that, we used to do that, try to motivate them and convince them, and inspire them and all those sorts of things.

And we realized that whatever we tried to motivate them with was really more about us, kind of our dream for them, rather than their dream for themselves. So, one of the very first exercises we walk any of our owners through, and it’s just for them, it’s not for their teams, it’s just for them, is a vision story exercise.

(23:10):

Now, you might hear that and immediately your brain starts to fill in the gaps of what I’m about to say. Don’t do it, just suspend it. This is not Mad Libs for what I’m about to talk about, so a vision story is not a sentence, and it’s not a paragraph. It does not sound like, “We wish to be the world’s premier software.” I don’t care.

(23:27):

None of that’s motivating for me. So, what we did is it’s actually one of the very first templates we rolled out to those clients that I told you about. So, what we built is a vision story template in seven categories. I’ll give them to you. You can just do this on a scratch sheet of paper. Just so you know, most vision stories are about two to five pages in length.

(23:46):

So, this is, again, not a paragraph and not a sentence. So, when we have an owner write out a vision, what we’re doing is we’re having them write a detailed snapshot of the future of their business. So, they’re looking out necessarily over today, they’re ignoring today and they’re looking way out there.

(24:01):

And usually we tell them, “Hey, just if you’ve never done this before, go three years and you can start there. So, let’s pick a date, but pick a meaningful day.” So, in that meaningful date, Courtney, I’m going to ask you, so it’s 2025 at the time of this recording. I know I just violated podcast rules. I’m not supposed to say dates, but I want you to think out to 2028.

(24:20):

You don’t have to tell us why this date is meaningful, but I just want you to pick one meaningful date in 2028 that would be meaningful for you that you already know is going to happen.

Courtney Mattern (24:30):

Gosh, Feb. 3.

Scott Beebe (24:34):

Okay. So, I’m not going to ask you why, but that could be a birthday or an anniversary, or your start date at work or whatever it might be, but that date has meaning. See, if I just pick Dec. 31, 2028, it’s just a day. But if I pick Feb. 3, 2028, that’s the day that fill in the blank. That something significant happens in your world.

(24:52):

So, our next vision as a business matures May 15, 2025. It’s just coming up here in the next little bit. Why? It’s the day my son graduates from college. It’s a meaningful day for us. So, we start the vision story with the term, with the date that’s out there, and then the very next section, it’s finances.

No, no, no, no, no, no. Remember, we’re trying to compel people. Money doesn’t motivate people. Money fuels people for the things that motivate them to be able to go do it. So, what we start with is the family freedom section of the vision. In other words, what do you want your family and friendships to look like by Feb. 3, 2028?

(25:27):

And let’s start naming people. Let’s name their ages. You may not want to name their ages, but nonetheless, you get my point. Let’s name things about them that will be true at that point. Let’s talk about where we want to go on vacation. Let’s talk about what we want to spend our time doing and be very detailed with that.

(25:42):

It’s not just I want to go on a luxurious vacation. It’s I want to go to Istanbul in the summer for a week and a half, and I want to have a Turkish breakfast every single morning. That’s motivating. And then there’s the freedom section of this as well. That’s what do you want your personal schedule to look like by Feb. 3, 2028?

(26:03):

So, you start to articulate that down, so we’re doing a snapshot of what’s out there. Now, I’m not a voodoo guy. I don’t get into all this ethereal stuff and whatever. I’m a spiritual guy, but not like a name it, claim it, whatever. But there’s something meaningful about writing things down and then starting to go for those.

(26:18):

So, we got the term, the family freedom, third section is the financials. That’s where we say, “Okay. This is the amount of profit that we’ll need to fund our family and our freedom by Feb. 3, 2028.” So, we write that down, then we go down to the product and service.

(26:32):

Because we got to have the products and services to sell to generate the finances, to fund the family and freedom by that time, so that we lay out what our ideal product and service looks like. And it’s not just, “Well, we build homes.” No, no, no, no. What kind of homes do you build? Do you build $3 million and above?

(26:48):

Do you build $500,000 semi-custom? What do you build? Let’s articulate what that looks like, so we know who’s in and who’s not in. And then after that, we identify the ideal team that services the product and service that generates the money, that funds the family and freedom, et cetera. And then the final two categories is our ideal client.

(27:08):

Who do we work with? And just as important, who do we not work with? We ask our clients all the time, “Who is the worst client you ever worked with?” It takes them about a half second to come up with the name and we tell them, “Don’t tell the name out loud. I don’t want to not like them forever.” And then the final category is culture.

(27:23):

If you had a client that was sitting across the restaurant just in the next booth, but they didn’t know you were there and all of a sudden they were talking about you behind your back and the experience they had with you. What phrases would you want to hear them say? So, we have them write that down.

(27:36):

So all told, 2, 3, 4, 5 pages of detail, and you’ve got a detailed future snapshot of what the vision of the business looks like. And Charley, at that point, they’re motivating themselves to go toward that.

Courtney Mattern (27:48):

So, when someone comes to you, they might pick up the phone, they might say, “Hey, I need My Business on Purpose because I need to fix my job costing.” You say, “Whoa, whoa, let’s take a step back and let’s work on this vision story. What do you want in three years?” I think that’s really interesting because I think everyone wants a fix-it-quick solution. Everybody wants the answer to their problem, but there could be many solutions.

(28:14):

There are many times that we have problems here at Buildertrend that we’re trying to solve where we throw a couple different things. And what I’ve learned is like, “Okay. I might have this solution but I can’t be too attached to it because I’ve seen things that I thought for sure were my problem. For sure, this was the answer to fix it, and it actually ended up being something completely different.”

(28:31):

But if you know the long-term goal of where you want to be, it makes it easier to not worry about those small things and maybe fix something that’s even bigger.

Scott Beebe (28:44):

Yeah. And Courtney, sometimes we’ll fix the job costing. We’ll say, “Hey, yeah, we’ll go ahead and fix that. That’s no problem.”

(28:50):

But we want you to understand where job costing situates within the whole, and that’s really what we’re going after at that point.

Charley Burtwistle (28:57):

Gosh, this is just awesome. I know we prefaced with if we run up to time, we’re going to have to cut it and wrap things up, but this is so good. Scott, really appreciate it. Maybe just a couple more questions to wrap in under the gun here before we wrap things up.

(29:14):

What are some of the … So, you do the vision story, you lay everything out, what’s the next step to implementing it? You’ve talked about these four different pillars. Do you typically try to fix everything all at once, or do you focus in on a key area that’s maybe the biggest problem child and dive in there?

(29:33):

But how do you take this roadmap of how I want to get to where I want to go and actually start tackling it?

Scott Beebe (29:39):

Yeah. Charley, what we’ve done is we’ve built everything in our model out and themed on climbing and hiking, because we ourselves like to climb and hike. Even though we live in South Carolina, there’s not a lot of altitude there, but nonetheless, we like to do that. And we run our coaching through a three-phase model.

(29:55):

Base camp is the first phase in what we call our installation roadmap, that’s where we take an existing owner, and they’ve got a tool belt. A lot of times they have tools in their belt, metaphorical knowledge tools to run the business. They’re out of place or they’re not sharp, or they’re missing some things or whatever.

(30:11):

So, the installation roadmap installs them with all of the tools within those four P’s, all the purpose tools, the people tools, the process tools and the profit tools. Dashboards, financial dashboards, all kind of job costing tools, project start tools, things like that that we get them up and running with.

(30:29):

And then we move into our first mountain phase and that’s where we tell them, “Hey, you trust us as your guide now because we just outfitted you with all of these great tools, and we got you working. Now, we’re about to hike, and I want you to know that this mountain we’re about to hike, a lot of other people have hiked this mountain. And we’ve hiked this mountain hundreds of times, so you can trust us in this mountain.”

(30:48):

So, we start to do it. And that mountain is all about implementation, repetition, predictability and meaning. Everything we just built, we need to repeat it and do it over and over and over again, and refine it so that it becomes habitual into the business. At that point, the business owner starts to build a business that runs and grows with or without them.

(31:07):

This is where your software really takes off, by the way, and so we can take a lot of those processes and methodologies and begin to pull that out. So, we’ve got a lot of clients that have a lot of Buildertrend process that we’ve videoed through screen capture and all that, and it’s on what we call our master process roadmap.

(31:22):

So, every single person has their own roadmap through that, and they build that in and now they create redundancy throughout the organization. So, they’re not the only person, or that person’s not the only person that can do this. And then the third phase is what we call the second mountain. This is where it gets dicey.

(31:37):

We’ve never climbed that mountain, and you’ve never climbed that mountain because it’s the second mountain is unique to you. We actually got this concept from a guy named David Brooks, who’s a New York Times columnist, and he wrote a great book called “The Second Mountain.” And in it he talks about the life on the second half.

(31:52):

Well, what we do in that phase is we actually work with owners. I’m a certified exit planning advisor as well, so we work with contractor owners and we realize that most contractor owners by that point are actually making decent money. And they need to do other things with those monies and the resources, and their net worth and all of that.

(32:08):

And they’re starting to think, “Should I exit this thing or transition this thing, or bring in owners or employee stock ownership plan, what should I do?” And we begin to quarterback that experience with them. We coordinate with their primary advisors, CPAs, financial planners, estate planning attorneys, tax strategists, all that, because they all talk to each one of those individually but never together.

(32:30):

We need them to talk to them together so that they’re making decisions on the same page. So, once they get to the second mountain, that’s really where we begin to transition into situational coach and advisor on their both personal and professional life and what they do. But each of our coaches has a three-year roadmap that they walk clients through, so it’s very methodical.

(32:48):

But after the vision story, the very next thing we do is move into financial dashboards because that’s usually where people feel the most pain. And we’ll stabilize that, and then we’ll move on to other things from there.

Courtney Mattern (32:58):

I love the harmony, again, between My Business On Purpose and Buildertrend. We’re all about calming the chaos. And we’ve been saying in some of our marketing materials, “Confidence begins when the chaos ends.” And I like that third phase of your plan where not only have they climbed the mountain of whatever chaos there was in their business to grow and make it successful.

(33:18):

But now they’re planning for the future of things that might be possible. Being confident that they can retire, being confident that they’re leaving a legacy or a business to someone else or their community. I think it’d be really fun, we can wrap this up, because you’re going to be at the Builder’s Show in Vegas at the end of February. We’ll be there, too.

(33:39):

At the Buildertrend booth, we have daily happy hours from 2:00 to 5:00 p.m. Hopefully, our friends there from My Business on Purpose, you’ll be able to come and hang out with some of our customers and see what it’s like when we talk about ending the chaos, building confidence. Taking control through processes with the right coaches that will hold you accountable.

(33:58):

So, that you can be confident in a future that isn’t like one of your clients said that just Monday through Friday is all the chaos. Like no, they can think about three years from now or five, or 10 or 15, I’m confident that I’m going to retire.

Scott Beebe (34:14):

Yeah, yeah, and whatever their plan might be. We’ve had a lot of people that they go, “Hey, I want to retire. I want to sell this or just close the doors.” And we go, “Hey, you know what’s even more fun than retiring? Is having a business that runs without you and you continue to get paid.” That’s a fantastic gig, and it can happen.

(34:29):

You can build that up and start to build what that business looks like. But a lot of times the mindset, Carol Dweck talks about this in her great book, it’s called Mindset. And she talks about the difference between a fixed mindset and a growth mindset. So many, we found so many contractors are in that fixed mindset.

(34:45):

And we’re so excited to be able to go, “No, no, no, you don’t have to submit to that anymore. There’s something way better right over here, and this is the work that’s required.” And you just show them the map, and all of a sudden they go, “I can do that, I can do that.” And we’re like, “Yeah. Not only can you do it, but it’s way better to be able to do it.”

(35:01):

So, we’re so grateful for the service that you provide because what we usually tell people is, “Hey, we need you to prove to us that you can use a spreadsheet for three months. If you can use a spreadsheet for three months, then let’s get you to the software.” And by the time they get to the software, they are so ready to dive in.

(35:18):

And you’re right for wanting to calm the chaos and having a tool to be able to do it. The challenge that we try to work in on our end from coaches is making sure that they actually use the tool. Too many times they use 18% of the tool, and we’re like, “Oh my gosh, there is a wealth here that we can get you set up with.”

Courtney Mattern (35:37):

No kidding.

Charley Burtwistle (35:38):

You’re preaching to the choir, Scott. This is awesome. Thank you so much for the time today.

(35:44):

Before we sign off here, if someone’s listening to this, they say, “This sounds great. I love everything that Scott’s saying,” where can they go to find out more?

Scott Beebe (35:52):

Oh, yeah. Thanks, Charley, I appreciate that. Yeah, we have a cool assessment. If you want to take a test and really test the back-end health of your business, like the systematic health of your business, we created this five-minute assessment. It’s super easy, it’s not goofy, it’s the real questions that we ask. You go on there and go to MyBusinessOnPurpose.com/healthy.

(36:11):

So, it’s MyBusinessPurpose.com/healthy, and you’ll take that five, seven-minute assessment and answer honestly. And you’ll get a score back there and with a score, it gives you some insight on where you’re at and then maybe some next steps on what you want to do. And then, of course, we can follow up with you.

(36:26):

And if you want to hop on, we usually do a no-strings attached, ask us anything call. So, one of our coaches will hop on and go, “Hey, what’d you hear? And what do you need?” And if you want to ask how we can work with you, just ask us and we’ll tell you.

Courtney Mattern (36:39):

Okay. We’ll make sure we put that in the show notes and hopefully we’ll have you back again soon, because there’s so many things to talk about. I feel like we barely scratched the surface.

Scott Beebe (36:49):

Certainly have. Yeah, I’ve tried to hold back. I know it doesn’t sound like it, but I’ve tried. There’s a lot more that we could talk about, so I’d love to be back on.

Charley Burtwistle (36:56):

Love it. Scott, thank you so much for your time.

Scott Beebe (36:59):

Thanks, guys.

Charley Burtwistle (37:00):

Well, we just heard from Scott Beebe, founder and head coach at My Business on Purpose. Fantastic guy, fantastic interview. Courtney, what did you think?

Courtney Mattern (37:09):

It was even better than I expected. When I first met Scott and his team from My Business on Purpose, it was almost like, I don’t know, you get those sparks of we are on the same page. We’re both setting out to help clients, business owners, contractors achieve the same thing, calming the chaos, getting a handle on their business so that they can live their life to the fullest.

(37:33):

And I think that we brought him on to talk about job costing and financials, because we know that is a pain point that we’re hearing from a lot of builders. But he forces us to take a step back and say, “Okay. Wait, you think you know what your problem is, but it might just be a symptom.” And I think that that’s why he’s the business coach.

Charley Burtwistle (37:51):

Yeah. What’s funny is he was taking the same approach with us that he was describing that he takes with his prospects or clients of like we were wanting to talk about this one specific issue. And I’m sure he has a ton of people that come to him wanting to talk about job costing specifically.

(38:05):

And he is like, “Whoa, whoa, whoa, Charley and Courtney, slow down. Let’s zoom back out here.” Which was a really refreshing approach because I think a lot of times people do try to sell you a solution based on what you perceive the problem to be, and they’re trying to not sell you.

(38:22):

They’re trying to help you understand and fulfill your vision story, and where you’re trying to go and be. And he took the same approach in this interview as he would with a client, which I thought was refreshing. And I think I may want to hire Scott as my personal life coach.

Courtney Mattern (38:35):

Yeah, no kidding. You can tell that he is a parent and that he’s worked in team settings for a long time because he’s holding you accountable.

(38:43):

He’s making you rethink what you just said. Do you think this is the problem? But is it really the problem?

Charley Burtwistle (38:49):

Yeah.

Courtney Mattern (38:49):

And one thing that aligns so much, too, with Buildertrend and My Business on Purpose is that keyword the purpose, talking about building a better life.

(38:56):

Because it’s one thing to solve the problem of money for your business to grow, but why are you doing that in the first place?

Charley Burtwistle (39:02):

Right.

Courtney Mattern (39:02):

It’s you need to think about why you built that business, what you want your life to look like.

(39:07):

And that really shines through in everything that I’ve heard from him and his team. So, I’m really looking forward to seeing them all in person at the Builders’ Show.

Charley Burtwistle (39:15):

Absolutely.

Courtney Mattern (39:16):

And seeing what we can do together to help our customers.

Charley Burtwistle (39:19):

Yeah, I’m fired up to see him out in Vegas. Courtney, what time are the happy hours again at the booth?

Courtney Mattern (39:23):

Yeah. There’s two happy hours happening at the Buildertrend booth. You won’t be able to miss it because our booth is massive and gorgeous. Thanks, team. But Tuesday and Wednesday, we’re having happy hours from 2:00 to 5:00 p.m. On Tuesday, we’re inviting all of our partners, so manufacturing partners, supplier partners.

(39:42):

Our partners that we work with like Breakthrough Academy, BTA, APB. We’re going to have suppliers there like Emser, or like Mike Weaver will be there. And then on Wednesday, we’re doing a Meet the Pros Happy Hour. And that one, we’re inviting all of our very best customers that you might follow on social media, you might’ve heard on the podcast, people like Brad Leavitt.

(40:02):

Nick Schiffer will be there from Modern Craftsman Podcast, Joe Christiensen from Cardinal Crest. Basically, a big party because …

Charley Burtwistle (40:08):

Charley Burtwistle from “The Building Code.”

Courtney Mattern (40:10):

Yeah. Us, we’ll be there, but it’s just a chance for you to get to hear from other builders like you. Get to meet and build that sense of community that really, I deep down believe that really sets Buildertrend apart.

(40:22):

And it’s all the people that are using it, and all the advice we share and the ways that we lift each other up.

Charley Burtwistle (40:28):

Very well articulated, Courtney, but you have to see it to believe it, so we’ll see you at Vegas. Until next time, I’m Charley Burtwistle.

Courtney Mattern (40:35):

And I’m Courtney Mattern.

Charley Burtwistle (40:36):

Peace.