How to always be marketing your company: Hogan Design and Construction

Show Notes

This episode of The Building Code features guest Brad Hogan of Hogan Design and Construction, who joins us from the Chicago, Ill., area. And before you ask, he is a Cubs fan. We had the pleasure of meeting Brad at Buildertrend University and just knew we had to feature him on the podcast.

Hogan Design and Construction is a family operation: Brad’s brother is the owner and Brad acts as COO. Besides having a large mix of work – from small remodels to commercial builds – the company loves putting out a good newsletter. While many companies have ditched the newsletter for other forms of marketing, Hogan has stuck with it and has seen great results. Their newsletter is simple and is used mainly to keep the Hogan name present in people’s minds. They send it out once a month with tips and tricks, company information and news to an audience they’ve gathered via their website and through both current and prospective customers. Want to subscribe and see it action? Check it out here.

Hogan Design and Construction has strong community involvement. From buying people breakfast at a local breakfast spot to giving back to charities near and dear to their employees’ hearts, this crew makes their presence known in their community … for both high quality construction work and charitable efforts. And, truly, the Hogan team acts out of kindness, but if a new customer comes from it, that’s even better.

A passion point for Brad? Marketing his construction company at all times. Not only does the Hogan team spread their branded pens around the Chicago area, but also they always hang a Hogan sign on every job site. We specifically enjoyed hearing all about their “Pardon Our Dust” efforts for the homeowners’ neighbors. The Hogan team drops off letters and branded dustpans to introduce the company and project to the neighbors – a clever courtesy so they know what’s going on in their area.

A question we ask our customers we feature on The Building Code is, “Do you track your lead sources?” For the Hogan team, that’s a definite “yes” … but it wasn’t always the answer. Up until two years ago, they didn’t track their lead sources until they realized they were spending marketing dollars without seeing the return on their investment. But now, the Hogan team is able to confidently identify Facebook as their most popular lead source (side note: social media is a common answer among our guests). As for where they’re tracking the leads, it’s all within Buildertrend! They utilize our CRM and love having one spot to see what’s working and what’s not.

Want to know more about what the Hogan Design and Construction team is up to and their tips for success? Be sure to listen to the full episode!

Hogan Design and Construction
Hogan Design and Construction Community Involvement
Hogan Design and Construction Facebook
Hogan Design and Construction Newsletter
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Transcript

Tom Houghton:

Youโ€™re listening to โ€œThe Building Code.โ€ Iโ€™m Tom Houghton.

Paul Wurth:

Iโ€™m Paul Wurth.

Tom Houghton:

Today, joining us on our episode, we have Brad Hogan. Heโ€™s the chief operating officer at Hogan Design & Construction. Welcome โ€ฆ โ€œWelcome Hogan.โ€ Welcome Brad.

Paul Wurth:

All right.

Brad Hogan:

Thatโ€™s all right. You can call me Hogan. Iโ€™ve been getting called that since I was a kid.

Paul Wurth:

There you go.

Tom Houghton:

See, weโ€™re just โ€ฆ Brad and I, we go way back.

Paul Wurth:

You mean Hogan and you?

Tom Houghton:

I was making it conversational for you.

Paul Wurth:

No, I get it. Hello, Hogan. How are you doing?

Brad Hogan:

Iโ€™m doing great. Thank you guys for having me on here. Iโ€™m excited to talk to you.

Paul Wurth:

Yes. We are excited to have you. You are coming to us straight from Illinois. Is that outside Chicago? Where are you guys based out of?

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Weโ€™re about 45 minutes west of Chicago, Geneva, Illinois.

Paul Wurth:

Okay. Obvious question, Cubs or White Sox?

Brad Hogan:

Iโ€™m a Cubs fan. Iโ€™ve been a Cubs fan since I was a little kid.

Paul Wurth:

All right. There you go.

Brad Hogan:

Right now itโ€™s a good time to be in Chicago.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s right. Itโ€™s exciting. Bradโ€™s joining us because โ€ฆ Youโ€™ve not only been a client for a long time, we met each other probably a few different times, but most recently at a Buildertrend University in Omaha. We just thought you and your company are really cool, and wanted to tell your story on the โ€˜cast.

Tom Houghton:

Speaking of story โ€ฆ Thereโ€™s actually two Hogans, right?

Brad Hogan:

There is. My brotherโ€™s the owner, and I work for him.

Tom Houghton:

Thatโ€™s good.

Brad Hogan:

As the COO. Big time.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. Heโ€™s not messing around.

Paul Wurth:

Letโ€™s just start there. Tell us about your company as it relates to what you guys focus on, type of work, number of employees.

Brad Hogan:

We actually do all kinds of โ€ฆ Weโ€™re more of a project management firm. We can do small projects, we can do large projects. We do residential, we do commercial. We do new construction, we do remodeling. Weโ€™re kind of a mix. We actually have 10 full-time employees and two part-time employees. We were founded in 2000, I came on in 2002, and weโ€™ve just been plugging away.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s really interesting. A lot of people do like to segment themselves for a lot of obvious reasons. You can create processes. If youโ€™re just doing kitchens, thatโ€™s your wheelhouse. You create processes around kitchens. If youโ€™re just doing new homes, thatโ€™s your wheelhouse. You create processes around new homes to streamline. You guys find that you can really have a wide variety and still work, right?

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Absolutely. Really, the processes, to me, they all feel pretty similar. Kitchens, bathrooms, basements. There are similarities and thereโ€™s differences. When you get into larger scale projects, those processes change a little bit. But as long as youโ€™ve got those defined, getting through a project big or small, theyโ€™re all pretty similar for us.

Paul Wurth:

Who handles sales for you guys?

Brad Hogan:

Itโ€™s a combination of myself and my brother. I do most of our residential remodel sales. My brother does more of our large commercial, large new construction projects.

Paul Wurth:

Got it. Weโ€™ve talked a lot about the sales process for construction companies over these last few episodes. Framed in that conversation, when you guys do everything, how do you select your projects, then?

Brad Hogan:

We have a pretty good screening process that we start with right from the get go, whether they reach out to us online or through a phone call. Our office manager reaches out and goes through a checklist of questions that we ask, just to see if itโ€™s a good fit.

Brad Hogan:

Big thing is budgets. A lot of people donโ€™t โ€ฆ Itโ€™s a scary word for people to talk with their customers about, but we want to know about it right away because we want to make sure that itโ€™s going to line up with our expectations and their expectations. Because thatโ€™s one of the biggest problems, I think, that construction companies have, is that they donโ€™t want to talk about the money. That causes a lot of problems later on.

Brad Hogan:

Really, an ideal customer for us is just somebody whoโ€™s done this before and really wants a better experience. They want to have it managed correctly. They want to make sure that theyโ€™re communicated with well. Thatโ€™s what we specialize in.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s really interesting.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. I like that.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s an interesting wrinkle into the qualification process. Iโ€™ve never heard that before. โ€œWe want people who have done it before and had a normal experience.โ€ Which is, typically in this industry โ€ฆ Not to say anything about the business owners, but itโ€™s not great, communication-wise. Youโ€™re really looking to deliver on the communication and have a raving client because of how you guys do things in your company. Thatโ€™s really smart.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Raving fans. Thatโ€™s what weโ€™re looking for. We want customers to really appreciate what we did for them.

Paul Wurth:

Itโ€™s similar to here. Here in Omaha, Buildertrend is definitely a tech-friendly company. Brad, youโ€™ve been here. Pool tables, bars, all that great stuff we have here.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Awesome.

Paul Wurth:

We actually look for the same thing. We look for people who have had a normal corporate cubicle job and go, โ€œWeโ€™re going to blow your socks off here,โ€ with culture and what we are.

Tom Houghton:

Definitely.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s a cool strategy Iโ€™ve never thought of in construction.

Tom Houghton:

You guys, I noticed on your website, there, youโ€™ve got an award there for the Remodeling Big50. Thatโ€™s quite the award.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. I think that was three years ago. Yeah. That was exciting. We were super honored to get that. We always just think of ourselves as a small company thatโ€™s outside in the โ€ฆ Weโ€™ve gotten a little bit of recognition, so itโ€™s kind of nice.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s awesome.

Tom Houghton:

Hard workโ€™s paying off, for sure.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Absolutely.

Paul Wurth:

That probably helps.

Paul Wurth:

The other thing I noticed on your website โ€ฆ Weโ€™ll put your website, obviously, in the show notes, just so people can check this out. Again, I think this is for the listeners who, theyโ€™re business owners out there, and youโ€™re thinking about your website.

Paul Wurth:

You guys have a newsletter. Now, whatโ€™s funny about a newsletter is that in some respects, itโ€™s an outdated โ€ฆ

Tom Houghton:

Concept?

Paul Wurth:

Thing. It is. But, actually, more and more businesses are actually going back to it, quite honestly.

Tom Houghton:

Itโ€™s a good way to stay in touch with your clients.

Paul Wurth:

And have a subscriber. Basically when you subscribe to a podcast, same kind of thing, right?

Tom Houghton:

Yeah.

Paul Wurth:

Like, โ€œI have 500 people subscribed to my newsletter.โ€ This is a great avenue to communicate and resell. Is that how you guys think of it? Take me through what that looks like.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Itโ€™s one of the touchpoints for us. People, a lot of the times during our sales process, we ask if theyโ€™re interested in receiving that, then throughout the process we just double check with them. We talk to neighbors about it. Itโ€™s just a way of getting in front of people.

Brad Hogan:

Our marketing strategy is a little different than most in that weโ€™re not big on the ask, we just want to be present. We want people to see us. We want people to know about us. We want to be the person that they think of. A monthly newsletter helps because weโ€™re hitting at least once a month. Past customers, even people that we didnโ€™t use, theyโ€™re seeing us quite often.

Paul Wurth:

You just got a brand-new subscriber. Probably just came through. My nameโ€™s on it.

Paul Wurth:

What should I expect every month? Because I think thatโ€™s the other trick with newsletters, or really any content for a construction company. Youโ€™re really focused on construction, the sale, and then doing the job. But then, if I have a newsletter, what do I put in it?

Brad Hogan:

Weโ€™ve toyed back and forth with a very informative, lots-of-information newsletter where you had click-throughs, and links, and all kinds of things, but we just wanted it to be simple. We touch one topic a month, whether it be change orders, or calendars, and marketing aspects. We touch one subject a month.

Brad Hogan:

Then on the side column, there usually is something about our company over there. We hired somebody, or somebody just got an award, or the company won an award. Itโ€™s real simple, and it lands back to our website, so it drives traffic to us.

Paul Wurth:

The angle is industry news, industry tips and tricks. โ€œIf youโ€™re going to do a home, remember change orders are important,โ€ things like that. Then obviously itโ€™s about your business, too, like personal news.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Absolutely.

Paul Wurth:

Cool.

Tom Houghton:

I love the integration of the team aspect of that, also because, on your website, you have a whole section dedicated to your team. I think thatโ€™s just a great takeaway for any of our listeners, to have pictures and a little brief bio, because when somebody comes across your team member, they instantly have that connection. They go, โ€œOh, yeah. Iโ€™ve seen that face before.โ€ You remove that initial barrier of, โ€œDoes this person actually work for them?โ€ Or โ€ฆ You know.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. I started saying, we actually were looking at incorporating a little bit into that into our production. Right now we do it for sales. When we have a sales call set up, theyโ€™ll get an email with my picture on it or my brotherโ€™s picture, and just said, โ€œThis is whoโ€™s coming out tomorrow.โ€ That way they know. Weโ€™re thinking about doing it a little bit more with our field guys prior to their introduction. Same thing.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s a great point. Iโ€™ve heard a lot of companies do that. I think itโ€™s something that anybody listening should take out of this podcast and probably do right away.

Paul Wurth:

Iโ€™ve seen some people do it through the actual owner portal, through Buildertrend. Letโ€™s say that you guys, post-sale, you make a deal. Thereโ€™s a profile picture on the owner portal area. Weโ€™ve seen them put, at first, the project managerโ€™s face there or the teamโ€™s face there. When the client first logs into the portal, which should be a part of your onboarding process to a new client, they can see the team thatโ€™s working on their job before they go to the site. That is a good way to do that.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. I like that idea.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Itโ€™s cool.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. I didnโ€™t think of it. One of our clients.

Tom Houghton:

Somebody else. Yeah.

Paul Wurth:

I donโ€™t come up with the ideas, I take credit for them.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. Not you.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. Not me.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah.

Paul Wurth:

Itโ€™s funny. We didnโ€™t have a plan to completely dissect your website and ask you about it, but-

Tom Houghton:

But we are.

Paul Wurth:

I have another question about your website now. Which, by the way, itโ€™s a great website. Itโ€™s hogandesignandconstruction.com. Check it out.

Paul Wurth:

Your community page, is that just your blog posts, or is there another angle there for community for you guys?

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Weโ€™re very big into community, and weโ€™re trying to develop that even more. We recently launched on Facebook. We call it Project Hope. Basically what it is โ€ฆ It started out with us talking to our team members, or myself and my brother, or whatever, just finding something that hits their heart. Then we will either donate money, which โ€ฆ We prefer not doing money. We prefer doing some sort of tangible gift that we can give to them. We had an employee who had a big affinity with AA, so we did a pool table for them. We do things like that to just say that weโ€™re giving back to our community.

Brad Hogan:

We really do. We care about our community, where itโ€™s important to us. Just being present and doing things โ€ฆ Recently we gave back to the whole community. We bought breakfast for, just, random people at a popular breakfast place for about an hour and a half. We just paid for breakfast for everyone for about an hour and a half. People were very excited about it, posting on Facebook. Just, it was a fun thing to do, because youโ€™re just surprising people. Hogan Design & Constructionโ€™s paying for your breakfast.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s awesome.

Tom Houghton:

Thatโ€™s really cool.

Paul Wurth:

Itโ€™s cool marketing, but obviously you can tell, for you guys, it comes from your heart.

Tom Houghton:

Right.

Paul Wurth:

Trying to engage your employees, and you and your brother. The reality is, itโ€™s probably as old as time. People like free stuff, especially food.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. Thatโ€™s true.

Paul Wurth:

T-shirts. People go wild.

Tom Houghton:

T-shirts are โ€ฆ Yeah.

Paul Wurth:

The Buildertrend t-shirt, I want to tell you โ€ฆ

Brad Hogan:

Speaking of Buildertrend t-shirts, I love your t-shirts. I got more than I was supposed to when I was there. My wife wears one. I wear them all the time. I think theyโ€™re great.

Paul Wurth:

Honestly I was joking about that, but itโ€™s a cool marketing tool. Weโ€™re always on somebodyโ€™s mind because weโ€™re on the t-shirt.

Paul Wurth:

Beyond the community, do you and your brother, or the business, do you guys have a budget and/or a strategy for brand awareness? Iโ€™ve seen a lot of companies do a lot of different ways.

Brad Hogan:

We do.

Paul Wurth:

How do you guys get the brand out to the community, besides, obviously, the Project Hope or community here?

Brad Hogan:

To be honest, these kinds of activities are our biggest things. We do things that โ€ฆ Weโ€™re not looking to โ€ฆ One of the things that we do thatโ€™s pretty cool is we send out pens to anybody who contacts us, and then customers. Then they get pens every three or four months, just two or three pens. Itโ€™s got our content, so basically my business card, wrapped around it. I got to tell you, anywhere I go in Geneva, I see my pens. I seen them at restaurants. I see them at galleries. I see them everywhere. Iโ€™m like, โ€œThis is working.โ€

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s cool. Thatโ€™s an easy one.

Tom Houghton:

Thatโ€™s a great win.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. Easy ones that everybody should be doing. Let me ask, do you guys have your logo on all your trucks, company trucks, and the truck you use?

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. You can see my shirt.

Paul Wurth:

Got t-shirts.

Brad Hogan:

We got our Hogan shirt.

Paul Wurth:

Yep.

Brad Hogan:

Hats. Swag. All of our trucks are lettered. We have a big sign in front of our very prominent location in Geneva. All of our job sites have a lot of signage on there. We draw a lot of attention. A lot of times people will just come up to me and they say, โ€œWe see youโ€™re working here, we see youโ€™re working there. Come do an estimate for us.โ€ Yeah, that kind of stuff works real well.

Paul Wurth:

Signs are fairly cheap, but getting into wrapping your buses and trucks, and a bunch of t-shirts for your team, and even more swag. Thereโ€™s shockingly a lot of construction companies that donโ€™t do that stuff. Their employees are out there in whatever. Their employees donโ€™t have the logo on the car. They donโ€™t put signs in the yard every single time. Those are basics to marketing that could really deliver leads, right?

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Absolutely. One of the things that we do, like you said, yard sign. Yard signs are great, but one of the things that we also do โ€ฆ Our project managers will visit somewhere between 10 and 30 houses around the property to drop off a โ€œpardon our dustโ€ letter.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s good.

Brad Hogan:

We donโ€™t just drop it off, we have them introduce themselves. We have them give business cards. We give them a little โ€ฆ Itโ€™s a little broom, dustpan that says โ€œPardon our dust,โ€ and itโ€™s got our logo on there. Itโ€™s one of those things. We really are trying to draw attention to us being in the neighborhood, because we want to keep working there.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s awesome.

Brad Hogan:

It works. Our guys are very diligent, and they really โ€ฆ It brings in some business.

Paul Wurth:

Weโ€™ll have Super Producer Brooke grab a picture of that for the show notes, because thatโ€™s a definite takeaway for everybody. Thatโ€™s really cool.

Tom Houghton:

That is. Itโ€™s great because, also, in neighborhoods when construction is happening, I think most neighbors are always upset about it. I like that youโ€™re being proactive about that and saying, โ€œWe know weโ€™re going to be making some noise,โ€ or whatever. โ€œHereโ€™s a way to contact us ifโ€ โ€ฆ

Paul Wurth:

What is he, like โ€ฆ Is he demoing, like using dynamite?

Tom Houghton:

Heโ€™s doing a lot of demo work.

Paul Wurth:

All right.

Tom Houghton:

I guess.

Paul Wurth:

I donโ€™t know.

Tom Houghton:

I donโ€™t know. Iโ€™d never be upset. Itโ€™s like, โ€œGood. Theyโ€™re improving their house. The value goes up.โ€

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s a good takeaway.

Brad Hogan:

Itโ€™s surprising what people get upset about.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah.

Tom Houghton:

Thatโ€™s true.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s a good point.

Tom Houghton:

Have you been on Nextdoor?

Brad Hogan:

Yeah.

Tom Houghton:

I mean โ€ฆ

Paul Wurth:

Whatโ€™s Nextdoor? Is that some sort of dating app, or โ€ฆ

Tom Houghton:

Brad, do you know what Nextdoor is?

Brad Hogan:

Nextdoor, the โ€ฆ Theyโ€™re a lead-generation company, arenโ€™t they?

Paul Wurth:

Yeah, what are you talking โ€ฆ Whatโ€™s Nextdoor?

Tom Houghton:

Brooke? Producer Brooke?

Brooke:

Itโ€™s an app.

Tom Houghton:

Thank you, Brooke. Producer Brooke-

Paul Wurth:

I understand itโ€™s an app. What is the purpose of the app?

Brooke:

Neighborhood.

Tom Houghton:

Itโ€™s a neighborhood app. Itโ€™s like Facebook for your neighborhood.

Paul Wurth:

Why donโ€™t people just use Facebook?

Tom Houghton:

Because itโ€™s old hat.

Paul Wurth:

Okay. Sure.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. Weโ€™ve moved on to Nextdoor.

Paul Wurth:

All right. Weโ€™ve moved on to Nextdoor. Thank you, next.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. Well played, there.

Paul Wurth:

Itโ€™s topical.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah, it was good. A little Ariana Grande reference.

Paul Wurth:

Good. I want to put a bow on this conversation about branding, marketing leads. Do you try or do you do a good job of tracking your sources?

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. We track all of our sources. Actually Iโ€™d say itโ€™s relatively new. We didnโ€™t try until we realized how important it was. Iโ€™d say weโ€™ve been doing it for about two years.

Brad Hogan:

Our biggest source is Facebook. Facebook is usually โ€ฆ Weโ€™re very prominent on Facebook. We do a lot of advertising on there. Then we have a lot of people looking for referrals, and we have a lot of people who recommend us from that. We do track it, because if youโ€™re spending marketing dollars and you donโ€™t know why, it just doesnโ€™t make any sense.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s a great story. Previous to a couple of years ago, you were still spending marketing dollars, and you really had no insight into which was working, which wasnโ€™t, besides gut?

Brad Hogan:

No.

Paul Wurth:

Then two years ago โ€ฆ Post, youโ€™ve been really tracking that. Are you tracking that in Buildertrend in our lead tool, or-

Brad Hogan:

Absolutely.

Paul Wurth:

Cool.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. We love the sales aspect in Buildertrend. We use marketing aspect for that, absolutely.

Paul Wurth:

Cool. You guys, whenever you set your marketing budget for the year โ€ฆ Do you have a marketing budget on a year basis, or how do you guys-

Brad Hogan:

Yes, we do. Yep.

Paul Wurth:

Do you guys just pull sold deals, and look at the sources and just use that as the guide?

Brad Hogan:

Yeah, weโ€™ll look at whatโ€™s going well, whatโ€™s not going well. We tweak it every year. Every year itโ€™s a little bit different. Sometimes weโ€™re putting more money towards things that we thought were going to work because they are working. We pull money away from stuff that was working. Yeah, definitely, itโ€™s a huge marketing โ€ฆ Having the Buildertrend portion of that is real nice, to be able to just look at it in a couple of clicks. This has worked much better.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. You got to have systems in place to track that stuff, which is cool. Iโ€™m glad youโ€™re using that.

Tom Houghton:

I love that all this stems around, bringing it back to very beginning point that you made, is just being aware, like people being aware of you in the community. If everybody knows about Hogan, itโ€™s like, โ€œI need to remodel my kitchen. Who am I going to use? Oh, that guy who I just used a pen to sign for my check at the restaurant,โ€ or โ€ฆ You know what I mean.

Paul Wurth:

Even subliminal.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. Thatโ€™s just so great.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Like I said, it takes a lot of work to get there, but itโ€™s a good way to do it.

Tom Houghton:

Sure. Yeah.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s right.

Tom Houghton:

Obviously you guys do a lot of different projects. Whatโ€™s a project in your mind that stood out as one of your more recent favorite ones that youโ€™ve worked on?

Brad Hogan:

Actually weโ€™re working on two really cool ones right now, where itโ€™s โ€ฆ One of them, itโ€™s a coffee house in downtown Geneva, that โ€ฆ Also they have a second store thatโ€™s a chocolate store. They donโ€™t have enough length for production, and honestly their coffee house is a little small. Weโ€™re putting a huge addition on the back of it. Itโ€™s in a historic district, so we had a lot of historic issues that we had to deal with on the front end to make sure that we got through. Thatโ€™s one of the big projects that we have going thatโ€™s pretty cool.

Brad Hogan:

Then also weโ€™re doing a build-out โ€ฆ Actually itโ€™s a banquet hall slash coffee house, but itโ€™s also a church. Itโ€™s a cool combination of all of that. Itโ€™s right in the heart of one of the neighboring suburbs here, downtown Aurora. Itโ€™s going to be a very, very cool finished product. Weโ€™re excited on both of them to see how itโ€™s going to end.

Tom Houghton:

Thatโ€™s awesome. A little multi-use mixed space, sounds like.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Exactly.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. I feel like thatโ€™s a trending direction.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah, for sure. For commercial stuff, for sure, right now.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah.

Paul Wurth:

Thatโ€™s cool. Yeah. You guys are even into light commercial stuff as well.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Light commercial. Yeah, we do everything. We go small projects, big projects, commercial, residential. We love it.

Paul Wurth:

How are you guys set up? Do you put a project manager on each project as the lead, or โ€ฆ Tell me a little bit about your production setup.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Itโ€™s funny. Our production has grown so much because โ€ฆ When I say grown, warped and changed. Because when I first moved into that end of things, my brother, he was like every owner-operator. He did everything, and didnโ€™t really like parting away with things.

Brad Hogan:

Slowly, when he moved me out of the field and into the management, he called me a production manager, but really I was just managing all of our projects. Which was real busy, and actually part of the reason we found Buildertrend was because of that. We needed some way to manage schedules. That was the biggest thing. โ€œI need a schedule.โ€

Brad Hogan:

When we sell a job, all of our jobs come with project managers now. Our project managers are not on site 24/7, but they are available 24/7. Our project managers run somewhere between โ€ฆ Active in field, they have somewhere between three and five jobs on at the time.

Paul Wurth:

Okay. Yeah. Thatโ€™s what I was thinking.

Brad Hogan:

Theyโ€™re bouncing back and forth between projects.

Paul Wurth:

Okay. You like to keep it around three to five at a time. I guess the other question is, how do you guys handle โ€ฆ Because itโ€™s you and your brother in the sales process. Typically thatโ€™s where youโ€™re talking scope of work, and really the tangible things around the job, everything youโ€™ve discussed in the sales process and the estimate. How do you communicate that information to the production team? What does that hand-off look like?

Brad Hogan:

Thereโ€™s that. We actually have a production startup sheet that we use. Basically, itโ€™s kind of interesting because the way that it starts is the first meeting, when the job is sold, we bring our project managers to that meeting so we can walk them through the space, walk them through the scope. At least get their heads wrapped around it.

Brad Hogan:

But then it goes back, and my job as production manager, I go through the first portion of our sheet, which is getting Buildertrend live and up and running, getting everything inputted that I have on the sales end, whether that be plans, and scopes, and spec sheets, and all that kind of stuff. I get that inputted. Then that sheet gets handed off to the project manager, where they plan the jobs out. They do their schedules, they do their purchase orders. That also, again, all goes through Buildertrend.

Brad Hogan:

Then once thatโ€™s done, it goes back to me for review. I make notes, I meet with them. We tweak it again. Then it goes back to them to make the adjustments. Then the final step is, once they lock in a start date, it goes back to me for my final processing. Then Iโ€™ll get some of our GuildQuality, can sign up and finalize Buildertrend, lock-in start dates, lock in baselines, all that kind of stuff. Then it goes into production.

Paul Wurth:

Awesome. I love that you use baseline, because that is a great way on the production side of things to see where youโ€™re winning and losing.

Paul Wurth:

Letโ€™s go down that road a little bit. You guys confirm a length of the job. Letโ€™s just call it 90 days. First off, do you guarantee that 90 days? How do you communicate that to the client? What does that look like?

Brad Hogan:

The way that our schedule looks is it spells out everything. We let them see the whole schedule right from the beginning. Depending on the length of the schedule, thereโ€™ll be buffer days at the end of the job. Sometimes itโ€™s a week, sometimes itโ€™s a month. It depends on what the scope and what process. The schedule, what we tell people is, โ€œThe end of the buffer days is when we will be done.โ€ Unless if something along the line changes, and if thereโ€™s a change order, theyโ€™re going to get that information in the change order. Itโ€™s going to tell you the price, the scope of work, how many days itโ€™s going to add to the project. But, the whole time itโ€™s being tracked through Buildertrend and through the customer so that theyโ€™re aware.

Brad Hogan:

Then we tell them upfront. The schedule is a living, breathing thing. Weโ€™re a construction company. Thereโ€™s going to be times where, especially here in Chicago, we might have the plumber scheduled, and then the day before, pipes are frozen everywhere. Heโ€™s not coming to your job site because your job site is not an emergency. We explain that. Our project managers are going to get it back on schedule. Weโ€™re going to double stack people, or whatever, to try to keep it under there. We will finish on time, assuming thereโ€™s not change orders. Thatโ€™s pretty much how that works.

Paul Wurth:

I have a ton of questions after that. Thatโ€™s great.

Paul Wurth:

Transparency. We talk about that all the time. We preach it, obviously. We preach it as best practice. Obviously do it through Buildertrend. Right. Makes sense. Had you always been that transparent as related to the schedule, or did you make a shift in your company philosophy at some point?

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. No, we werenโ€™t always that transparent. It was honestly when Buildertrend came up, and then we actually started showing them our schedules. Thatโ€™s when it became more transparent. We had to be more transparent because they were seeing what our plan was.

Brad Hogan:

Whereas before, weโ€™d say โ€ฆ โ€œHow long has this project going to take?โ€ โ€œSix to eight weeks.โ€ But nobodyโ€™s tracking that. They kind of do, but now you can actually see it. Theyโ€™ll say, โ€œIt looks like you guys are behind.โ€ Then our project managerโ€™ll say, โ€œWe are behind, but hereโ€™s what weโ€™re going to do to make it up.โ€ Yeah, we werenโ€™t always that way. It became considerably easier when we could see it in front of us.

Paul Wurth:

What have the results been about being more transparent with the client as it relates to your relationship during?

Brad Hogan:

GuildQuality, weโ€™re very highly rated. We just got our, actually, Guildmasters award. Our customers are happy with us. Communication is the most important part of any kind of project, and the more transparent โ€ฆ Customers are realistic. They understand that things happen, but if youโ€™re trying to pretend like theyโ€™re not happening, thatโ€™s when the frustration is going to add up.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. We talk about that all the time. Good. Iโ€™m glad that thatโ€™s consistent.

Paul Wurth:

The last thing, just to follow up, because this is what I asked the question โ€ฆ Internally, we had a 90-day schedule. Weโ€™ve got the baseline view. For those who donโ€™t know, you start your schedule, you click on a button called โ€œbaseline viewโ€. Basically what that does is that takes a snapshot of your original schedule. Then as you make changes throughout the job, itโ€™s going to ask you why, and track who made those changes, and give you a roll-up. As a business, do you guys look at that job by job, or every quarter or every year, and say, โ€œWhy are we good or bad?โ€ Do you analyze that information?

Brad Hogan:

We do. Absolutely we do. To be honest, weโ€™re still learning. I was actually in a meeting today about bigger projects, and focus on that, and how to lock it in and get it under control. Just, thereโ€™s more variables that happen.

Brad Hogan:

One of the things that happens is you get into that thing where, โ€œBecause this happened, I have more time.โ€ We donโ€™t want that. Because it happened, it doesnโ€™t matter. We still want to finish on time. Thatโ€™s our goal. Itโ€™s great. Itโ€™s great to be able to track it and look at a project. Then we do, I know people donโ€™t like that word, but, an autopsy when the jobโ€™s over, and just look through it and see what happened, and what we can change going forward.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. I get why people donโ€™t like that word, but I think itโ€™s a critical part of anybodyโ€™s process, right?

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. We try to call it a debrief internally, but-

Brad Hogan:

Debrief. Yeah.

Tom Houghton:

I like โ€œautopsyโ€. Thatโ€™s cool.

Brad Hogan:

I do too. I donโ€™t know. Iโ€™ve always just said it.

Paul Wurth:

Should we start doing that, Tom? Me and you, once the podcast gets-

Tom Houghton:

After the podcast is over, โ€œLetโ€™s autopsy this.โ€

Paul Wurth:

Every Thursday it gets released, weโ€™ll just crack a beer and criticize each other.

Tom Houghton:

Thatโ€™s โ€ฆ Sounds like fun.

Paul Wurth:

โ€œBoy, you could have done better there.โ€

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. I thought maybe weโ€™d wrap this up really quick with just maybe some insight that you could provide to the listening audience. You guys have been extremely successful. You work in a lot of different spaces, not just residential, but also commercial. For the listeners out there who are seeing your success and going, โ€œHow can I have a part of that,โ€ what would be your advice to them?

Brad Hogan:

Thereโ€™s so much I could say, but really the biggest successes that weโ€™ve had is our team, building our team, and really having confidence in them. Itโ€™s the thing that drives us. My brother, Brian, and myself, we have a lot of visions. We have a lot of ideas. But without our team behind us, we wouldnโ€™t be able to do the things that weโ€™re doing. Itโ€™s really just establishing a team, good rapport with your guys, make sure that they have the same culture that you guys talked about. They want to represent that. Itโ€™s so important. Itโ€™s making sure everybodyโ€™s on the same page. Thatโ€™s really what I would say.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. A lot of contractors I talk to, and even our clients, you guys do a ton of things right as it relates to how you go to market, how you build your brand, even the community stuff. We didnโ€™t get into how you guys create culture. Thatโ€™s probably a great thing to get into at some point. Maybe weโ€™ll have you back on. Weโ€™ll talk culture.

Brad Hogan:

Yeah. Iโ€™d love to.

Paul Wurth:

Cultural talk with Hogan and his heroes. Again, and then also utilizing systems. Of course Buildertrendโ€™s a backbone, but even if itโ€™s not, you got to have systems in place and you got to track staff to get better, right?

Brad Hogan:

Really important. When thereโ€™s no system, you canโ€™t repeat it.

Paul Wurth:

Right. Yep. Great. I guess I was just saying you guys do a great job.

Brad Hogan:

Thank you very much. I really appreciate that.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah.

Brad Hogan:

Itโ€™s great.

Tom Houghton:

Brad, thanks so much for joining us on the podcast today and sharing your experience. We really appreciated getting to know you and about your company.

Tom Houghton:

Donโ€™t forget to check out our show notes page, where you can find out links to their website. Weโ€™d love to see some pictures of those two jobs you mentioned, too, and then the gift that you give out to the community.

Paul Wurth:

The dustpan.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. The dustpan.

Paul Wurth:

The dustpan thing.

Brad Hogan:

Awesome. Thank you very much. I appreciate it, guys.

Paul Wurth:

Appreciate you, man.

Tom Houghton:

Thank you.

Brad Hogan:

Good to see you.

Paul Wurth:

Good to see you again.

Brad Hogan:

Take care.

Tom Houghton:

Love what you heard? Donโ€™t forget to rate and subscribe to our podcast so you can hear from more guests that will benefit your business. Also, please check out our show notes page for more information on what we discussed on this episode. You can find it at buildertrend.com/podcast. Thanks for listening. Weโ€™ll see you next time on โ€œThe Building Code.โ€

Paul Wurth:

Appreciate you.

Brad Hogan | Hogan Design and Construction


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