Fire-resistant homes with Christine Ross: Addition building and design

Tom Houghton:

You’re listening to “The Building Code.” I’m Tom Houghton.

Paul Wurth:

Hello, Tom. I’m Paul Wurth.

Tom Houghton:

Seasonal greetings to you, Paul, on this new year.

Paul Wurth:

The new year, I’m going to do the into different every time, just to see if I throw you off.

Tom Houghton:

I would welcome that for the whole year. A whole year of new intros coming your way.

Paul Wurth:

It’s on. It’s 2020.

Tom Houghton:

That’s right. On this episode of “The Building Code,” we’re joined by Christine Ross of Addition Building & Design, based in Sherman Oaks, California. Welcome, Christine.

Christine Ross:

Hi. Thank you, guys.

Paul Wurth:

Hello. Thanks for having us. You told us right before we jumped on that unfortunately, during this time of year, you’re not taking advantage of California. You’re actually in Ohio.

Christine Ross:

I am. I love the snow, but it’s not really snowing here. It’s a green Christmas this year.

Paul Wurth:

My kids and I were talking about that. And only Midwest people, I think, well, maybe only Midwest people, but it’s kind of a bummer if it’s just cold and there’s no snow. If it’s going to be cold, give me the snow. You know what I mean?

Christine Ross:

Absolutely. I’m like, what’s the point of my suffering if it’s not going to be pretty?

Paul Wurth:

Exactly.

Tom Houghton:

Exactly. Yeah.

Paul Wurth:

Well, it’s one of those years. That’s okay.

Tom Houghton:

Well, Christine, we always like to start off with our guests getting to know a little bit about their company. So maybe give us a background of Addition Building & Design.

Christine Ross:

All right, so Addition Building & Design, we’re a design build firm. We’re based in Los Angeles. My dad started the company 40 years ago in Ohio, and I worked with him since I could remember. I mean, I used to have cereal with him when I was in grade school, when he’d be starting the scheduling. And then as I got older, into high school, I would work in the offices and work with pricing out different things, windows and doors and siding, and things like that.

Christine Ross:

And as I got older, I had my own company, doing other things in a different industry. And then I was like, “I really miss it. I miss design. I love building.” And so about six years ago, my dad’s like, “All right, come on in.” So I came in. We do a lot of large-scale home build-outs. So a lot of Malibu, Pacific Palisades, Studio City, Bel Air, Beverly Hills. You’ll see a lot of our projects there. And a lot of large-scale additions and remodels, like 600 to 10,000 square feet, I guess, is about where we usually are at with our project sizes.

Tom Houghton:

Awesome. That’s really cool.

Christine Ross:

Yeah. It’s really fun. I love it. I love the design part, so it’s good. I love being onsite, making sure the foundation and framing is perfect, part of the job.

Paul Wurth:

So how would you describe your role in the business? What do you do, day-to-day?

Christine Ross:

I handle the sales and project management. So my daily job, I go to visit the job sites and make sure everything’s running smoothly for doing foundation, framing, plumbing or electrical rough-in, or on the finish work. I make sure everything is according to plan and done correctly.

Christine Ross:

And also, I do a lot of the interviews, the marketing. I work a lot with our staff. We’ve got a full staff in the office, so make sure that our relationships with our subcontractors and all of our vendors are going well. We’ve had these relationships with people for 20 years, so it’s really important that they’re always going smoothly and everyone’s happy.

Tom Houghton:

That’s awesome.

Paul Wurth:

That’s great. Yeah. So you’ve mentioned interviews, so marketing, social media, you have a pretty good Instagram following. Is that something that you oversee?

Christine Ross:

It is. I have it on my phone, so I try to take pictures of them going. I’m on so many job sites every day and I’m like, “Oh, my gosh. I got to take a picture.” So I’ll get a great shot of my dad with a client. I think one I just got a couple of weeks ago, is a beautiful shot of my dad and a client looking over the wooded property on the third level of her deck. I try to get really meaningful photos, things that show how we interact with our clients and we stay really close with them.

Paul Wurth:

That makes sense. So you had mentioned you’re in LA and Beverly Hills and Malibu. And obviously, those are areas that people know about. Obviously, they’re higher-end areas, but they also probably have their own challenges. What are some of the unique things about building in California?

Christine Ross:

So the building codes are strict when it comes to green building. Addition Building & Design, we’ve always been on the cutting edge of green building. It’s always important to me, not only in building sustainably, but giving back, like Habitat for Humanity. If we take out all the cabinets, I want to make sure that those cabinets are going to someone in need.

Christine Ross:

But basically, you have a lot of fire resistance codes that you need to keep up with, which is certain materials, Hardie boards, cement tiles, clay tiles, no wood-burning fireplaces at all, whether you’re in a high fire risk zone or not. What else is there? Fire sprinklers. If you’re touching 60% or higher of the house, you have to put in a whole new fire sprinkler system, which is a really big deal. Dual pane tempered glass and windows, windows and doors, no decks. That’s another thing. We use composite products for decking and anything that’s wood, obviously, on the property. Things like that.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. It seems like everything… Not everything. A lot of it’s surrounded around the fires that we’ve heard about in and around your area. Can you talk a little bit about your experience with that over the last six months to a year, and what maybe a fire resistant home looks like beyond the things you just mentioned?

Christine Ross:

So fire resistant, you’re going to see just a lot more cement, I guess.

Paul Wurth:

Oh, attractive.

Christine Ross:

You’re trying to build prettier cement products. You’re trying to build prettier cement tiles. There’s Hardie board, there’s cement walls, which the cement walls are very expensive, so it’s still wood framing, but the Hardie board. Mainly, it’s getting the client like the design of the fire resistant materials they have to use.

Christine Ross:

Landscaping, putting cement around the whole house, like three to four feet out from the wall. Let’s see, what else? Oh, the overhangs are stuccoed. So when you look up, everything’s closed in. Once the fire gets up in your attic, it’s done. So you got to make sure that you’re keeping that from happening. And just homeowners, they’re not really liking cement around the house. So we have to make it pretty, make it a pattern, things like that.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. It seems like if everything was fire resistant, it would be very much like a post-apocalyptic-type looking vibe.

Tom Houghton:

It’d be like the Cybertruck.

Paul Wurth:

It would.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. Just steel and concrete.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. So there’s probably an opportunity for manufacturers to make aesthetically appealing fire resistant-type stuff. Right?

Christine Ross:

And even green, like there’s saving water. So we have a lot of the water bins. We’re saving the water that pours off the house. I mean, it’s so ugly. The homeowners hate them. They’re these ugly, huge water bins in front of their house, right in the front yard. And they’re like, “Why do I have to have this?” “I’m so sorry, it’s code.” And they’re like, “It’s so ugly. I have this beautiful home.” And then you have the water barrels, right in front of the house.

Christine Ross:

There’s only one company that makes them and they’re all the same. And I’m like, “No, we really should make some beautiful water barrels.” You can bury some of them, but they’re a lot more expensive and they’re already an excess expense for the homeowner. Once you already know that you have to do that, they’re like, “I’m not going to spend even more burying it.”

Paul Wurth:

Right. Yeah. That makes sense. So with the recent fires, do you feel like there’s more regulation coming down the pike for your area, or is all this still in place right now?

Christine Ross:

It’s pretty strict right now. I don’t see how they can really make it more strict. I mean, especially with fire sprinklers. I think that what’s happening is that homeowners are becoming… They’re actually being more creative. So homeowners will be like, “Can I put fire sprinklers on the exterior of my home?” Sure. We put them on the roof all the time. We put them on their garages, outside.

Christine Ross:

We make sure that their landscaping is far away from the house. So they can’t really have bushes and things very close, because once that catches fire, it can jump over to the house. But they’re actually getting creative, which I like. I like a lot that they like to collaborate with us on how to make things work for them.

Tom Houghton:

Awesome. Thinking outside the box there. Yeah. Obviously, in 2019 there were fires in Malibu. There are fires in Thousand Oaks area. Kind of all over and by now, this’ll be two weeks ago, but Australia and Sydney, there’s tons of fires there that are affecting a lot of houses.

Tom Houghton:

So fires is something that I think we’re going to see more trouble with, going forward. And I guess, how do you approach that with your customers? Is this a talking point during the sales process? How does that conversation go?

Christine Ross:

Well, usually a home that we’re redoing now lately will have been, unfortunately, burnt down. But when it’s a new home build and it’s not really in a fire… For example, I had a client in Studio City. He’s not really in a fire zone, but he was concerned about it. He’s like, “My shingles are wood. That’s obviously very dangerous.” I was like, “Let’s do a Euroshield shingle. It looks really beautiful.”

Christine Ross:

And so it costs more money, but once I show them that it’s going to look great and they don’t have to worry about it, it’s good for the environment. LA, it’s easier to sell these type of products to clients there. Everyone’s really into being friendlier to the environment.

Tom Houghton:

Absolutely. And you’re probably seeing both sides of this. Obviously working in LA, but currently in Ohio, you’re seeing a little bit of this polar opposite in that mentality, maybe.

Christine Ross:

Yes. It’s very different. The architecture here is so different. I’m looking around and I’m like, “There’s so many peaks on houses. So many dormers.” It’s just so different. I see a lot of the modern farmhouse, and I love modern going up, so much contemporary. And I miss it. I miss that old Midwest style. I think it’s so charming here.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. How many homes are you guys doing in Malibu in the area? Are you just restoring homes that have been burnt down, or what’s going on there?

Christine Ross:

Building them from the ground up. So right now, we have three projects over in the area. We have one in Malibu and two in Pacific Palisades. And then we have, most of our other jobs are in Bel Air and Beverly Hills and Studio City.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. One fun fact about Pacific Palisades is that… So my wife used to work out there, actually. And the area around there is very rocky. Apparently the ground, obviously you can’t build tall structures if the ground is not suitable for it. Do you run into that problem, even just with residential over there, is the area?

Christine Ross:

We just get the soil test to find out where we can build out. And then there are specific rules on how high the house can be built. One of our clients, he’s like, “Can you just grade the property, so you can take it down four feet, so that we don’t have to worry about the height issue?” That’s one thing we did. We’re actually doing that for the Malibu house, because they want a taller house, but it’s like, “Just take out four feet of dirt.” So they let us do that. That’s one way of getting around it.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah, I love that creative idea there. We want to go up, but we need to go down first to go up. Yeah. That’s good. That’s really good. So all of the construction that you’re doing, obviously costs money. How are you handling that conversation of cost? Because I think there’s, unfortunately in today’s day and age, with the internet and every piece of data at your fingertips, somebody saying, “Oh, I just redid my kitchen for 10 grand.” And it’s like, but did you really pay 10 grand? Can you share some of your experience with talking to customers about cost?

Christine Ross:

Absolutely. Cost is always one of the top three things that people always ask about. It’s one of their top three things. It’s either specifications, cost, or timeline. And usually it’s cost that’s number one. Hopefully, you start with a design build company. I try to tell as many people that I can, meet your contractor first. They know the cost. They know exactly what it costs to build. And then we will help you find an architect that’s perfect for your style and your budget. And as well as the engineer and everything else.

Christine Ross:

So I’m finding that clients are really surprised by what things cost. And you’re definitely going to expect to spend, on average, $400 a square foot. If it’s hillside, you’re spending at least 1,000. And if you’re really going to go all out, there really isn’t a budget for square footage. It could be 4,000 a square foot, if you’re going to go really high-end with it. If you’re building a pool on the hillside, I mean, you’re spending a couple $100,000 just right there.

Christine Ross:

But I mean, when they say it’s $150 a square foot, do not believe them. You’re going to pay for it, one way or another. Either that contractor’s not showing up after a couple of months, or you’re going to have change orders that are just crazy. You don’t want to go with the cheapest contractor. You want someone that’s in the middle. We’re definitely never the cheapest. We’re always in the middle somewhere. And I know it’s hard to tell someone to do your research. I feel like when you do research online, I look at the numbers and I’m like, “There’s no way you can do a perfectly built bathroom for 15 grand.” You just can’t.

Tom Houghton:

Right. You’re cutting the corner somewhere.

Christine Ross:

You are. There have been jobs where I’ve given a bid to a client and they’re like, “You’re just too high for me.” And it’s all about cost. And I’ve driven past, two years later, and they’re still working on the project. I would have had that job done in four months and it would have been perfect.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. The trade-off of time there. Right?

Christine Ross:

You’re paying for it, one way or another. And another example, another tip I could give clients is look at your contracts when you get the bids. I had a client once, and this is a great example. Another contractor was $200,000 less than me. But when you looked at the contracts, there wasn’t anything specified. This client in particular wanted a second story addition. They wanted to push out the first floor. Kitchen remodel. Three bath remodels, and living room facelift.

Christine Ross:

There’s in no way, in that other contractors bid, what kind of addition you were getting, they just gave them a number and they were making only 10% profit on the job. So you have to look at that. What is your contractor charging you? Is he charging enough to stay on that job the whole time? That saved them a lot of money, by only charging them 10% profit. We charge at least 30. It depends on how big the job is and what’s going on. But we charge enough for that crew who’s on that job, every single day. So these are important things.

Tom Houghton:

I mean, when you’re breaking that out in the bid or proposal for your clients, are you disclosing that up front with them, just showing price comparisons? Or how are you doing that?

Christine Ross:

There are two different ways that I give a bid. One is my fee is included in every single thing, every line item. And sometimes I price it all out at my cost. And at the end, I’ll put 30 or 40% and show them what I’m making. It just depends on the clients and the type of job that it is. But if it’s already in the line items, I’m still pretty upfront about how much I’m charging.

Christine Ross:

And as long as they understand what they’re getting, that they’re getting reliability, they’re getting an entire staff that is available 24/7. It’s not a contractor that’s working out of his own truck. You can go to an office and have a meeting with staff. You have an interior designer working on your job site, as well as us. I’m there every day. We obviously use Buildertrend as a management system. They’re really getting a lot for… You get what you pay for.

Paul Wurth:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). Makes sense.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah, absolutely. I think customers too, are becoming more aware of that and the fact that there is a trade off there. And I think if you were to tell anybody, “Hey, we’re making 30% on this job.” I don’t think anybody would blink, because you’re providing a service. You’ve got to get paid in this. There’s obviously the hard costs that won’t fluctuate. But you guys are bringing a lot to the table with your services, your design background, and just the overall value that you bring.

Christine Ross:

Absolutely. I mean, I know change orders. That’s the biggest thing to me is I don’t like change orders. I think the only thing is a change order’s great if you’re like, “Listen, I’m going to go with that big door that I wanted. I’m going with the door.” So that’s great and wonderful.

Christine Ross:

But when it comes to the foundation or your framing pricing, I don’t want any big changes. And once we sign that contract, it’s hopefully just smooth sailing and we can just get through the job and do a beautiful job, make sure everyone’s happy and be done with it. No surprise charges.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. It’s interesting that you, and maybe this is more common than we think, than I think, that you guys take two different pricing philosophies. Typically, as I found, when you work with a construction company, they either do cost plus or fixed price. Just for probably internal, just, this is how we do it and we bid. So can you speak to what about the prospects makes you go, “Okay, I’m going to do this one fixed cost or this one cost plus”?

Christine Ross:

Clients that are really… They’re big sticklers on the line items. Even our billionaire clients have budgets, and when they are really tight with their budget, I will be even more transparent. I try to be as transparent as possible. But a lot of clients, they just like that, that it’s already in there. They’re more relaxed. They’re like, “Okay, I understand what you’re making off of this. Just let me know what everything is.” And sign the contract.

Christine Ross:

But sometimes our fee is negotiable, but not really. If anything, our subs will help us out. They’ll be like, “Okay, 10% discount on something.” And then we can get some prices down. But I would say that the client that’s really worried about budget is going to see what my fee is.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. And so following that string, so when the actual confirm bids are coming in from your subs and vendors and/or their bills, is everything available to the client to see, and you’re just showing the whole thing?

Christine Ross:

It depends. That’s another contract, it’s like an open contract, where we get three top bids and they can see everything, and then we put our fee on top of it. We typically do not do time and materials. I don’t work hourly. That’s just not how we work. We’re a high-end service and we have a lot of experience. I feel that contractors that have the time and experience and they give that customer service, they deserve their fee. They deserve that fee.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. Just interesting, the different philosophies that businesses decide. And I’m sure it evolves as you grow as a business, all the different factors in there too, and how you approach that. So it just sounds like you make a decision based on making the project go as smooth as possible. And somebody who’s going to be super detail-oriented is just always going to be that way, so we might as well just get it out of the way now and just say, “Hey, here’s everything.”

Christine Ross:

Of course.

Paul Wurth:

And somebody who may not be as interested in the details and just the final result, another pricing philosophy might work for them.

Christine Ross:

Yes, of course. We have a lot of celebrity clients and those clients need to know that they can trust us. And so everything, from the beginning, needs to be very transparent. Especially that they need to know who’s coming over there. They need to know everything. They’re already worried about anything getting out. So I just feel like it’s trust, first of all.

Christine Ross:

I mean, no matter what, something is going happen. It’s a construction project. It’s very emotional, it’s dramatic. You try your best. It’s one of the most stressful things someone can do in their lives. So you just try to give the best customer service you possibly can. And like you said, if you want customer service and you want the best companies, you’ve got to pay for that.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. That makes sense.

Tom Houghton:

Sounds like great television, actually, all the drama that’s involved.

Paul Wurth:

That’s why there’s so many TV shows. Yeah.

Tom Houghton:

Exactly.

Paul Wurth:

So a lot of your clients, you would say your celebrities, it’s really important their privacy. So can you tell us about all the ones that you’ve had? Give us a top five and who your favorites are.

Christine Ross:

No, I cannot.

Tom Houghton:

No.

Paul Wurth:

Some inside photos.

Christine Ross:

It’s funny because we’ll have subcontractors, they’ll be like, “Was that so-and-so?” And I’m like, “Yeah.” And they’re like, “Oh, my gosh. I couldn’t believe it. Don’t worry. I won’t say anything.” And I’m like, “Thank you. I appreciate that.” But I have worked on some homes right on the ocean. I just stare out their window, basically. It’s just gorgeous. There’s a couple homes.

Christine Ross:

One home, actually, I don’t normally do this, but the realtor was a good friend of mine. They were trying to get this house sold. They had remodeled their kitchen and bathrooms without permits. And so you know what happens when the building department finds out that you didn’t permit your remodel? So basically, I had to go through this entire process, getting the bathrooms and the kitchens permitted. And they lived right across the street from the ocean. It was like house, street, ocean. And I just stared. And I was like, “Oh, I love this view.” I’m like, “How could you even sell this house?”

Christine Ross:

But yeah, it’s fun. The codes, it’s all LA building department. So it’s not any harder for me, usually. The Santa Monica is really tough, especially with their green building. But I have a lot of friends and you kind of have to first scare people in the building department. You’re like, “All right, I’m going to find out how to get around this,” or “This is what my client wants and I better figure out how to get it.” And then once they realize, all right, you know what you’re talking about, then everyone’s super nice. And they’re like, “Listen, if you just pay $5,000, you can add 10% more square footage to your remodel.”

Tom Houghton:

There you go.

Paul Wurth:

There you go.

Tom Houghton:

Sounds like a deal.

Paul Wurth:

Just throw money at the issue.

Christine Ross:

You go there, I feel like you’re an attorney. You just have to know where the rules are and where you can get around them.

Tom Houghton:

Sure. Relationships are important in building.

Paul Wurth:

Exactly. And it’s a really unique industry too. You have to wear so many hats, which is interesting. And also, being a woman in the industry. There’s not many quite honestly, in this industry, specifically in construction, that are owners of businesses or even play a significant part. What’s your take on that?

Christine Ross:

Oh, when I first started, it used to make the so insecure. I was like, “Oh, my gosh. I’m the only girl that they’ve probably ever seen on a construction site, let alone selling them a project.” But I feel like the more I got to know my stuff, the more I could tell them about their plans, the better it was. They were just like, “Oh, you know your stuff. It’s not even a problem.” And I think I bring a lot. I care a lot. I think that’s just something a woman does.

Christine Ross:

I come in there and construction’s already nostalgic for me, because I grew up around it. And so I really care that they’re going to be put out, as far as the work, my guys are going to be in there, working. I want their home to really suit their personality and their needs. And I think that comes across when I meet them. And they’re hugging me after I leave. They’re like, “Oh, my gosh. This is great. I feel so comfortable.” And I’m like, “Good. Okay. I’m happy.” And I just don’t see it as a problem anymore. I used to, but now I don’t think gender even matters.

Tom Houghton:

That’s good.

Paul Wurth:

Yeah. It’s getting a lot better. I mean, I think people speak to it a lot. I mean, there’s definitely a shortage in just general construction work right now. And so the more and more of anybody who can come in would be great, and diversification is important. I mean, it’s good. It’s good that you see it as an advantage. That’s a great way to look at it.

Christine Ross:

100%.

Paul Wurth:

For sure.

Christine Ross:

I think it’s great that women are coming in. And if there’s any female architects or engineers out there listening, I’m looking for you.

Paul Wurth:

There you go.

Tom Houghton:

There you go.

Christine Ross:

I’m looking for you.

Paul Wurth:

Hey, start a little group.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah, that’s good.

Paul Wurth:

Get a networking group.

Christine Ross:

Come find me, please. You can tell when a man’s done a flip, things like that. I’m sorry. There are some amazing male designers out there, but I have so many homes out there that are flipped homes, and I come in and have to remodel the whole thing. And they’re like, “Why is everything done in gray? And why is the laundry room over here, but my bedrooms are up here?” I’m like, “Because a man who doesn’t do the laundry, designed this house.”

Paul Wurth:

There you go.

Tom Houghton:

That’s awesome. Well, we’ll make sure we put a link in the show notes to your company’s website, your Instagram page. And again, reach out to Christine, listeners, if you are interested in working with her, all those females out there. The female architects, especially.

Christine Ross:

Yes.

Paul Wurth:

Well, thanks so much for coming on and enjoy the rest of your holiday season in Ohio. Maybe you’ll get some snow. I’m hoping for some still.

Christine Ross:

I hope so.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah. It’s never too late.

Paul Wurth:

And the nice thing for you is that you have looking forward to going back to LA.

Tom Houghton:

You can leave the snow.

Paul Wurth:

We’re just here. Okay, yeah.

Christine Ross:

That’s true. I get to go back to the sunshine.

Tom Houghton:

That’s good.

Christine Ross:

Thanks for having me, guys.

Tom Houghton:

Yeah, thank you so much.

Paul Wurth:

Thanks so much.

Tom Houghton:

Love what you heard? Don’t forget to rate and subscribe to our podcast, so you can hear from more guests that will benefit your business. Also, please check out our show notes page for more information on what we discussed on this episode. You can find it at buildertrend.com/podcast. Thanks for listening. And we’ll see you next time on “The Building Code.”

Paul Wurth:

Appreciate you.